In this episode of The Lookout Livestream, Zeke Lunder and Michael Steinberg, a current CSUC pyrogeography student/storm chaser/videographer, reviewed mapping and on-scene videos captured by Michael during last week’s Palisades and Eaton Fires in Southern California. Steinberg documented the fire’s rapid spread, highlighting the critical role of embers and wind in igniting homes. He emphasized the importance of defensible space and proper home hardening. Despite new building codes, many homes were lost due to continuous vegetation and flammable landscaping. The conversation underscored the need for better urban planning and fire education to mitigate future risks.
Episode Outline
Introduction and Background of Michael Steinberg
- Zeke Lunder introduces the special episode and Michael Steinberg, a Chico State alum majoring in physical and environmental geography with a focus on Pyrogeography.
- Michael Steinberg shares his background, including his role as a reporter for the Watch Duty app and storm chaser since 2022.
- Michael discusses his experience documenting the Palisades Fire in Southern California, highlighting the differences in fire behavior compared to Northern California.
Overview of the Palisades Fire
- Zeke Lunder and Michael Steinberg begin with a Google Earth map showing the spread of the Palisades Fire, starting near Skull Rock and moving down into the Ridgeview Country Estates.
- Michael describes the scene when he arrived around 3:30 pm, noting the extreme fire behavior and the down-sloping effect of the winds.
- The fire quickly spread into homes, with Michael observing the plume rotating (a sign of extreme fire behavior) and the impact of the winds on the fire’s behavior.
- Michael emphasizes the lack of defensible space in the neighborhoods, with vegetation right up against many of the homes, making it easy for spot fires to ignite the structures.
Impact of Embers and Fire Behavior
- Michael narrates over his videos, and explains the concept of ember storms, where embers from burning homes create many new fires, spreading the fire rapidly.
- Zeke Lunder and Michael discuss the challenges firefighters face in controlling urban fires, especially when multiple homes are on fire and creating ember showers.
- Michael describes the chaotic scene in Altadena, on Wednesday morning and afternoon, with fire trucks driving past burning structures on their way to other fires, and residents trying to evacuate or retrieve belongings.
- The conversation highlights the in-applicability of the term ‘wildland urban interface’ in describing fire threats which accompany extreme wind events (as fires start long distances into the actual urban area), and the importance of ‘home hardening’ to prevent embers from igniting structures. Michael points out the challenges posed by exposed gutters and overhanging wood paneling.
Documenting the Fire’s Progression
- Michael shares videos and photos of the fire’s progression, showing the rapid spread and the impact on homes and vegetation.
- Zeke Lunder and Michael discuss the importance of understanding the role that homes, landscaping, and other structures can play in creating continuous fuel for fires.
- The conversation touches on the challenges of firefighting in urban areas and the difficulty in mounting a coordinated effort to stop the fire’s spread when many structures are burning across a large area.
Challenges of Firefighting in Urban Areas
- Michael discusses the difficulties firefighters face in urban areas, including downed power lines and the impact of winds on fire behavior.
- Zeke Lunder and Michael highlight the importance of defensible space and home hardening to prevent fires from spreading.
- The conversation includes examples of homes that survived the fire due to proper fire hardening and the challenges faced by homes with overhanging eaves and dense vegetation.
- Michael shares his experiences of documenting the fire and the emotional impact of witnessing the destruction.
Reflections on Fire Behavior and Community Impact
- Zeke Lunder and Michael reflect on the lessons learned from documenting the Palisades Fire and the importance of fire education so civilians can make sound decisions and avoid buying houses in places with extreme wildfire risks.
- The conversation includes discussions on the opportunities posed to re-imagine the urban footprints of places where the as-built condition was indefensible before the fire, and the futility of rebuilding the same footprint which was just destroyed by what was a predictable event.
Thoughts on the Dialogue Around Home Insurance
- Zeke Lunder says the insurance companies are the only institution which is able to tell the truth about the wildfire risk in certain areas because they are making business decisions, not political ones.
- Politicians often can’t be as forthright about the wildfire risk in certain areas because they don’t want to get un-elected for telling people not to build new homes in their community, or that a neighborhood is too dangerous to buy a home in. The insurance companies, on the other hand, are simply making actuarial decisions based on the data, even if the public doesn’t like the conclusions.
- So while the insurance companies’ decisions may be unpopular, they are able to use the science and data to make tough but honest assessments about wildfire risk, whereas politicians and public officials often have to balance other factors beyond just the facts. The insurance companies’ perspective provides important insights, even if the public doesn’t always agree with their conclusions.